2013 virtually problemless @ 92,000 BUT, :rant; kind of

[sonic2013ltz]

Yesterday I noticed red liquid on the garage floor. Now I have extended warranty on the car so all my maintenance has been done by a repair shop as I wanted documentation if anything should go wrong. That being said I thought it was tranny fluid as I have never seen the coolant color. I like the days where every liquid in a car was a different color. Anyway discovered that it was coolant. Now a tranny leak would have cost me 100 deductible, however a coolant leak cost me 400+. I would have preferred the tranny leak.

Apparently there are two metal lines w/ hoses running from the throttle body as bypasses. These are rotted and hoses frayed @ the bends(formed hoses) in the hoses. I could not for the life of me find anything on the R/R of these lines. So I was reluctant to do the job myself without understanding what I was getting into. 3/12 hours to do the job, which if you look at just the parts diagram look like two clamps and two o-rings. But something must be involved because it is a 3 1/2 labor hour job(checked numerous places)

Personally I do not understand why metal parts that have contact to the one chemical that has more anti corrosive stuff in it that any other, could rot out so fast. the pitting is remarkable. When I get the old parts I will post pics here. I have my old 91 GMC that still has coolant tubes in her that ae original. I think they were manhandled when the fresh air intake tube was replaced, They are right under that thing, and all it would take to get them to leak, especially in their condition, would be to press down on them.

 

[Natesriv]

Pic ?

 

[SuperFudd]

Which engine?

 

[sonic2013ltz]

continued

The engine is a 1.8 gas auto... I found a Chilton's page for the hoses in question and I find it extremely weird that these two little hoses and lines are a 400$ job. AND these metal lines are at the point of failure so soon. We just now got the call and are going to pick the vehicle up. I need to text the wife to get the old parts. BUT....

Now they tell me that the recall on the chime/key warning has screwed with my radio. In the sense that it can't have a software update done and that causes the recall not to finish. That radio worked fine, and according to the service writer still works but the only way to fix it(update the firmware) is a brand new radio, 800.00+. My extended warranty covers it with a 100.00 deductible. I always dread going to dealers, and this is one of many times where I bring a car in for a recall, and the recall repair causes something else to happen. and it always costs me something, whether its a deductible or some kind of cost. I hate recalls, I should have just done this repair myself for 10 bucks worth of hoses and just threw the recall notice away. ( i dont lock my keys in the car):sadbanana:

I post the pics later,, i gotta text the wife

 

[faseljd]

I refused to let the dealer do the recall when I took it in for my last free oil change.

 

[sonic2013ltz]

pics

and as you can see there was no reason to replace these plastic lines that were described to me by the service writer as 'corroded and pitted.. and the hoses look new,,, no frayed ends or swelling as also told by the service writer. He should have denied my request for these parts really, I did not ask for them at the beginning. and for that I am sure its the tech that BS's him about these parts needing replacement.

 

[sonic2013ltz]

last pics

These are the plastic pipes that were sooooo bad they needed to be ripped out and replaced

 

[Llia]

Thanks for those pics. Sorry this repair and recall caused you so much trouble.

 

[sonic2013ltz]

SURPRISE!!!! Coolant on the garage floor again. More than before, exactly the same spot. Like I said NOTHING wrong with the parts taken out. The wrench turner is nothing but a part replacer, certainly NOT a technician or a mechanic. Didn't bother pressure testing the system, stupid, especially after doing a bogus repair.

Its in for the stupid radio repair / recall ripoff, and that's how we noticed the coolant puddle on the garage floor.. called , text, email and no return to tell us they got the message. If I go there and find this coolant thing unaddressed, the service manager is going to wish he was on vacation, especially when I roll in on my wheelchair.:sadbanana:

 

[sonic2013ltz]

the end of the story:
It was the thermostat housing /water inlet seal (also... ). As if. the leak dripped in the exact same spot on my garage floor. Left side upfront, right on the exact stain mark as the first indication of a leak was. Right below the housing. The pipes and hoses that were replaced were on the right side and to the back and midway. No way possible for that to be the original problem.

3 1/2 hour job cost 400$, vs a 1 hour job 120$, and 5 days to fix it. If any of you are out here in California and reside in the Hemet Valley, stay away from Gosch Chevrolet. Either the mechanic is incompetent or a crook. the service manager is NEVER at his desk, or reachable to speak to. The service writer is not to blame, he is the proverbial 'messenger' only.

If I thought I could get my money back I would go after them, but I already know how this goes, after nearly 20 years in GM dealer parts during the 80's and 90's, this is non winnable. never again, got myself an AllData disc covering this year sonic.

:end:

 

[beljum]

Thanks for posting the details of your unfortunate problem. It gives us folks with 1.8 Sonics a heads up on what to watch out for.

I wonder if the steel part of those lines or connectors are a problem in the rust belt (such as Cleveland, near where I live) and your dealer just automatically assumed it was the problem from a GM notice. I see you are not in the rust belt (lucky guy!).

Since you already have a well written and detailed account of your issue, email it off to the regional service rep. Ya never know.

 

[sonic2013ltz]

To be clear.... the 'metal' assumption was by me when the service writer repeated what the 'parts replacer" told him, pitted and corroded. In reality, There were NO metal parts involved in this repair at all. All the tubes related to the throttle body heater inlet and outlet are plastic. Much like the new fuel lines. there was nothing wrong with them or the hoses that link the tubes to the throttle body.

There are two permanently mounted short metal tubes (flared for rubber hose mounting) coming from the intake. These are part of the intake manifold. (maybe the riser that the throttle body mounts to. The illustrations are not very specific on these.) But they are not serviceable separately. They are the only metal lines involved and they show no wear at all.

From what I can see, these throttle body heater lines are for the better vaporizing of fuel, and therefor better fuel burning and mileage. There are no repair videos or web references to these lines, seems like they are not likely to go bad in at least the first 100,000 miles anyway. It looks as though there is a pressure reducer in line so its not under high pressure, and therefor less likely to leak.

Anyway that's it. I will be happy to answer any other questions anybody may have regarding this repair.

 

[Maddmatts]

I wonder if the "pitted and corroded" is a limitation that's similar to what I sometimes see at work. When I replace/repair an aviation part, I have to select a reason from a drop-down list and sometimes there isn't an exact match for the condition. I then have to choose the closest equivalent with more detailed notes to clarify.

 

[sonic2013ltz]

I suppose that if he was using a form, digital or hardcopy, That could be true. Since I didn't see any and I was given the hand written diagnostic sheet, I have to say no. Aviation being so much more strict in their repairs I could see the whole system being refurbished. But as you can see from the images, there was virtually no wear indicators. Even the o-ring that was left, was soft and pliable still. Pretty sure this was a misdiagnosis, no pressure testing done afterward to check his work, and a cover up with the 'also' comment when referring to the housing seal being replaced.

The area of leakage was indicated by the puddle of coolant directly under that housing. Not the opposite side of the engine towards the firewall or under the throttle body. Even the hoses are not brittle or split at the clamped area. There is no coolant stains anywhere on the top of the motor or the rear of the intake where the quick connect ends of the tubes are located. The only area where there is any coolant stains are noticed are directly under the housing and down the side of the motor and on top of a support frame piece where it dripped to the floor.

I have taken my time to determine what the story is here. I am very sure that this is the situation. The only thing that bothers me is that I didn't fix the thing myself. The manager wouldn't even come out of his office to speak to me about my concerns. Wouldn't even look at me as we were leaving, all signs of guilt or at least, lack of knowledge of what's going on in his service drive. The only thing he did was reprimand the service writer for giving me the old parts. The dealership has also been accused by 'YELP' of forging customer reviews. Extremely unethical behavior.