007CobaltLS
New member
Not sure that the heat would be so bad, but the fact that it's mounted solid to it, rather than the bolts as you^ mentioned probably wouldn't be a good idea.
Little Tester had a good day...
- Thread starter Dave@ddmworks
- Start date
firstorbit84
New member
the bolts are not really designed to move either though...
All I know is that there is a style of rear torsion beam brace that bolts into the rear beam for various VW's that has been known to cause rear beam failures (granted, mostly in older, higher mileage cars).
I just don't know if I'd be willing to install a part that makes my rear torsion beam a consumable part/serviceable maintenance item, no matter how effective it is. Especially if I'm actually going to be driving the car at its limit occasionally, and still wanting to keep it for a long time as daily driven. If it was strictly a race car, then I'd have no problem, as basically the whole car becomes consumable at that point.
Now, there are major differences in the design of the rear beam and the new DDM brace compared to the VW part that I'm thinking of. So, it may not be an issue with our cars. But seeing images like this gives me caution:
from this part being installed:
All I know is that there is a style of rear torsion beam brace that bolts into the rear beam for various VW's that has been known to cause rear beam failures (granted, mostly in older, higher mileage cars).
I just don't know if I'd be willing to install a part that makes my rear torsion beam a consumable part/serviceable maintenance item, no matter how effective it is. Especially if I'm actually going to be driving the car at its limit occasionally, and still wanting to keep it for a long time as daily driven. If it was strictly a race car, then I'd have no problem, as basically the whole car becomes consumable at that point.
Now, there are major differences in the design of the rear beam and the new DDM brace compared to the VW part that I'm thinking of. So, it may not be an issue with our cars. But seeing images like this gives me caution:
from this part being installed:
JohnT
New member
I think you are correct in having caution here. The DDM brace appears to bolt directly to the flexible steel in the beam, at least from the picture. The bulk of the bending force will be distributed over a much shorter length of the beam. Add in crack propagation from the drilling and it could potentially lead to failure. That is all highly dependent on the stiffness of the bar and flexibility of the beam of course. And it probably still won't stop me from trying it
Despite potentially higher cost I would much rather see the brace bolt to the tubular "control arm" region or a more traditional bar and links setup
Corksport uses a similar bar for the mazda2 vs the racing beat version spreads out the force in mounting and overall length vs the B-spec kit that mounts to the spring cups.....I wish we had all these options!
Last edited:
$ub$onic
The Sticker Guy
You can twist a bolt till the bar breaks but the weld is gonna break long before that.
firstorbit84
New member
My friend has a Mazda 2 with the factory b-spec rear brace and he said there was no drilling required because the mounting holes were already there. That tells me that the manufacturer accounted for additional stress to the beam and placed the holes and designed the beam accordingly.
$ub$onic
The Sticker Guy
and mazda was smart
Dave@ddmworks
Supporting Vendor
the bolts are not really designed to move either though...
All I know is that there is a style of rear torsion beam brace that bolts into the rear beam for various VW's that has been known to cause rear beam failures (granted, mostly in older, higher mileage cars).
I just don't know if I'd be willing to install a part that makes my rear torsion beam a consumable part/serviceable maintenance item, no matter how effective it is. Especially if I'm actually going to be driving the car at its limit occasionally, and still wanting to keep it for a long time as daily driven. If it was strictly a race car, then I'd have no problem, as basically the whole car becomes consumable at that point.
Now, there are major differences in the design of the rear beam and the new DDM brace compared to the VW part that I'm thinking of. So, it may not be an issue with our cars. But seeing images like this gives me caution:
from this part being installed:
That design is definitely not optimal and not surprised it caused problems. The mounting bolts are being put in shear and also the mounting holes are very close to the edge of the material. It is also not really similar to the brace we have been testing.
The brace we have been testing is very similar to braces that have been used without issue on other torsion beams like this on the Mazda 2 and some other cars:
The rear torsion beams are very similar between both cars. We have a good local customer that we have worked with and there are a lot of similarities in the rear suspension. On the Mazda 2 there are 2 holes in the beam already that makes it easy to install the brace, but the thickness of the beam appears to be very similar overall.
The way that we have the brace designed right now, the mounting bolts are not in shear like the design that failed above and only in tension. Also the brace has unique shaped ends that make it sit flush along the inside of the brace, as shown in the cut away:
Hope all of that makes a little more sense.
Dave
JohnT
New member
Yes that looks good. I was assuming the worst (a flat plate with bolts through it) from a low res snapshot from underneath. So when can I order one?
badassnick
New member
When will the parts be available?
Dave@ddmworks
Supporting Vendor
The silicone is up and ready today!
http://www.sonicownersforum.com/forum/t5834/
Working on the others.
firstorbit84
New member
Nice. What's the estimated date and cost for the rear brace?
007CobaltLS
New member
That was my point...I wouldn't weld, I would bolt it in myself.
Dave@ddmworks
Supporting Vendor
We will know once we finish up some more testing and get the different sizes worked out. As just an FYI the bar that we are testing on the car now (the one in the pictures) tested the same stiffness as the solid 1" bar that we tested that mounted just below the springs and looked like a normal sway bar. We are going to put the stock suspension back on the car also and test a couple versions of the bar with that setup also to see what is going to work best for the different suspension setups out there. Once we finalize the sizes it is usually about 4 weeks for production pieces to be made and powdercoated.
As for final price, we hope to be right around $100 for the rear brace.
14T6MT
New member
You guys rock.
007CobaltLS
New member
Dave stop making new parts lol, I need to save my money. Fortunately for both you and me I'm gonna buy all this new stuff
Fixed
Come on now...how is it unfortunate in any way....you have fun parts, he makes money...it's win win.
007CobaltLS
New member
I wasn't fixing your grammar...did you see what I changed?
The capitalizing change and apostrophe for I'm were just my OCD needing to fix it...
What I did was change "unfortunate" into "fortunate"...
But since you're on it...you and I or you and me are both acceptable. You just aren't supposed to put I/me before you in that kind of grammar.
