Second gear grinding & remedy

[Dustin]

Dealer had it for 6 hours, was unable to reproduce. I told them it happens once you've been driving for a while and the trans gets hot, but the car had 3 miles on it.

I worked a deal and drove it around the block twice until it started grinding in second, went back to the dealer and they had a tech that actually knows how to rebuild transmissions ride with me. I was able to replicate it every shift into second over 4700 RPM. They're going to replace the trans under warranty after less than 15k miles.

Has anybody that's had the trans replaced had it solve their second gear issue?

 

[Tango71]

You know, it baffles me how some techs jump to "hey lets replace the transmission" rather than "hey lets try a better oil" I can just imagine how many good transmissions are being tossed out needlessly.

 

[ChrisJ]

You know, it baffles me how some techs jump to "hey lets replace the transmission" rather than "hey lets try a better oil" I can just imagine how many good transmissions are being tossed out needlessly.

I don't know, most real mechanics know changing from one oil to another doesn't work miracles. You'll also notice 9 out of 10 guys who tried going to some alleged "ultra oil" still have the problem. For example, if an engine has cracked rings or pistons and burning a ton of oil switching oils will not fix the engine. It will still burn oil and it's life will still be short.

I believe, according to Preloader he believes plastic fork ends are the problem and oil will not solve it.


Other than that, I honestly have no idea. I'm at 39,000 miles on whatever oil the thing came with and overall have no complaints but I drive like an old woman.

 

[Dustin]

You know, it baffles me how some techs jump to "hey lets replace the transmission" rather than "hey lets try a better oil" I can just imagine how many good transmissions are being tossed out needlessly.

The tech told me that Chevy will only replace, they won't let them actually tear into it to figure out what the problem is. After reading about the M32 in Europe, I'm guessing I'll just have the same problem again.

 

[lneff]

Here’s my story…

I originally decided to take my car in for the moisture issue that plagues 12-13 Sonics. While washing my car last week, I found a surprising amount of water in the front foot wells. Turns out that there is a TSB on this from Chevy so no issues getting that fixed. While that was the original issue to take it in, I have also had escalating transmission issues which I decided to have them look at since the car is so new (I bought it Feb this year with 219 miles on it; I have now put 5000 more on it). I noticed shortly after taking it home for the first time that 1st gear was sometimes impossible to engage when at a stop. I would have to either let the car roll backwards before I could engage anything, or press the shifter halfway through the gear path (against the synchros) and then ease off the clutch until it crunched into gear. I then started noticing that 1-2 would crunch for no reason, and then 2-3 started going…bad enough that once in a while when releasing the clutch after supposedly entering 3rd that the trans would just pop back into neutral. Now, everything up to 5th gear seems to require way to much effort to shift into gear. I have been driving manual for 11 years, and my last car with 110,000 miles and no trans service shifted smoother than my Sonic has been.

Today, after resolving the moisture issues, the dealer called me and asked that I come up and take a technician for a ride to demonstrate the transmission issues since they had not been able to reproduce them (even though I actually typed up a step-by-step instruction sheet on how to reproduce the issue). I first showed him that every gear required too much effort to shift into, but he only agreed with me on 3-4. But after the 3rd complete stop on the test drive, I had the issue where I could not shift into 1st. I had the tech then try to enter 1st and he couldn’t do it till I let the car roll for a bit. Good news? Immediately after seeing that issue he jump right to full trans replacement. This does seem to be a bit extreme for something that seems as simple as replacing a synchro, but so far I have been happy with the customer service. Now hopefully I will get my car back in a timely manner...

 

[ChrisJ]

Here’s my story…

I originally decided to take my car in for the moisture issue that plagues 12-13 Sonics. While washing my car last week, I found a surprising amount of water in the front foot wells. Turns out that there is a TSB on this from Chevy so no issues getting that fixed. While that was the original issue to take it in, I have also had escalating transmission issues which I decided to have them look at since the car is so new (I bought it Feb this year with 219 miles on it; I have now put 5000 more on it). I noticed shortly after taking it home for the first time that 1st gear was sometimes impossible to engage when at a stop. I would have to either let the car roll backwards before I could engage anything, or press the shifter halfway through the gear path (against the synchros) and then ease off the clutch until it crunched into gear. I then started noticing that 1-2 would crunch for no reason, and then 2-3 started going…bad enough that once in a while when releasing the clutch after supposedly entering 3rd that the trans would just pop back into neutral. Now, everything up to 5th gear seems to require way to much effort to shift into gear. I have been driving manual for 11 years, and my last car with 110,000 miles and no trans service shifted smoother than my Sonic has been.

Today, after resolving the moisture issues, the dealer called me and asked that I come up and take a technician for a ride to demonstrate the transmission issues since they had not been able to reproduce them (even though I actually typed up a step-by-step instruction sheet on how to reproduce the issue). I first showed him that every gear required too much effort to shift into, but he only agreed with me on 3-4. But after the 3rd complete stop on the test drive, I had the issue where I could not shift into 1st. I had the tech then try to enter 1st and he couldn’t do it till I let the car roll for a bit. Good news? Immediately after seeing that issue he jump right to full trans replacement. This does seem to be a bit extreme for something that seems as simple as replacing a synchro, but so far I have been happy with the customer service. Now hopefully I will get my car back in a timely manner...

Without syncros you cannot enter a gear usually while sitting still without letting the clutch up a little to get the gears to line up. Every time you shift, you must double clutch or it'll grind like you would never imagine, and not go into gear no matter how hard you push, it'd vibrate your hand numb.

Double clutching properly, will make a non-syncro tranny shift smooth as butter though.

 

[ShadowRS]

Mark your calenders folks, I believe this is the first time I have ever seen "double clutching" being discussed properly and not in it's ricer 2f2f format!

500 Points are awarded.

 

[lneff]

Here’s my story…

I originally decided to take my car in for the moisture issue that plagues 12-13 Sonics. While washing my car last week, I found a surprising amount of water in the front foot wells. Turns out that there is a TSB on this from Chevy so no issues getting that fixed. While that was the original issue to take it in, I have also had escalating transmission issues which I decided to have them look at since the car is so new (I bought it Feb this year with 219 miles on it; I have now put 5000 more on it). I noticed shortly after taking it home for the first time that 1st gear was sometimes impossible to engage when at a stop. I would have to either let the car roll backwards before I could engage anything, or press the shifter halfway through the gear path (against the synchros) and then ease off the clutch until it crunched into gear. I then started noticing that 1-2 would crunch for no reason, and then 2-3 started going…bad enough that once in a while when releasing the clutch after supposedly entering 3rd that the trans would just pop back into neutral. Now, everything up to 5th gear seems to require way to much effort to shift into gear. I have been driving manual for 11 years, and my last car with 110,000 miles and no trans service shifted smoother than my Sonic has been.

Today, after resolving the moisture issues, the dealer called me and asked that I come up and take a technician for a ride to demonstrate the transmission issues since they had not been able to reproduce them (even though I actually typed up a step-by-step instruction sheet on how to reproduce the issue). I first showed him that every gear required too much effort to shift into, but he only agreed with me on 3-4. But after the 3rd complete stop on the test drive, I had the issue where I could not shift into 1st. I had the tech then try to enter 1st and he couldn’t do it till I let the car roll for a bit. Good news? Immediately after seeing that issue he jump right to full trans replacement. This does seem to be a bit extreme for something that seems as simple as replacing a synchro, but so far I have been happy with the customer service. Now hopefully I will get my car back in a timely manner...

I got my car back yesterday evening from getting the transmission replaced. I haven't driven it a whole lot yet, but 1st gear is working great, and the remaining gears do seem much smoother when engaging. However, it is already back in the shop this morning...they returned it to me horribly out of alignment (if I straighten my wheel, i change lanes). They put 23 miles on the car testing out the trans and yet they didn't even notice...:sadbanana:

 

[klystron]

Dustin and Ineff, let us know if the trans replacement fix your problem. I'm on my 3rd trans (third shifter, third clutch, second flywheel, etc) and mine is worse than ever. I get a grind in 3rd gear (not as frequent as 2nd) and seems like the downshift from 3rd to 2nd misses about 1/3rd of the time.

My last 4 cars were a 97 z28, 99 trans am, 06 GTO, and 09 Cobalt (still have it) and all are manuals and none of them grind. GTO was prone to missing 3rd sometimes but that was something we always griped about. The point is that I know how to drive GM manuals.

 

[cndctrdj]

My last 4 cars were a 97 z28, 99 trans am, 06 GTO, and 09 Cobalt (still have it) and all are manuals and none of them grind. GTO was prone to missing 3rd sometimes but that was something we always griped about. The point is that I know how to drive GM manuals.

I'm in the same boat and Gm told me. "this is not a performance car like your others"

 

[lneff]

Dustin and Ineff, let us know if the trans replacement fix your problem. I'm on my 3rd trans (third shifter, third clutch, second flywheel, etc) and mine is worse than ever. I get a grind in 3rd gear (not as frequent as 2nd) and seems like the downshift from 3rd to 2nd misses about 1/3rd of the time.

My last 4 cars were a 97 z28, 99 trans am, 06 GTO, and 09 Cobalt (still have it) and all are manuals and none of them grind. GTO was prone to missing 3rd sometimes but that was something we always griped about. The point is that I know how to drive GM manuals.

So far since the service I have not had any trouble, but I have only been driving the car since yesterday so I may not have had the chance to re-create the issues. However, I generally drive "spirited" (others say like an ******* ) so I figure if its going to happen it would already be doing it. Overall, I super pleased after the trans replacement/alignment!

 

[lneff]

I'm in the same boat and Gm told me. "this is not a performance car like your others"

Funny...I spent a month deciding on my Sonic RS and the salesman constantly described it as a sports car. But I must say I was pleased with my dealer jumping right to replacing the trans...I was prepared for a fight if they got crass with me.

 

[Stew]

I'm in the same boat and Gm told me. "this is not a performance car like your others"

That's really odd because Chevy's website uses the word 'sporty' several times on the Sonic page. Not to mention athletic, aggressive, muscle and other synonyms.

AND, what about the commercials of the Sonic driving out of the back of an airplane, doing flips on huge ramps, etc. They are sure sending mixed messages.

 

[klystron]

I'm in the same boat and Gm told me. "this is not a performance car like your others"

Well, my Cobalt is not an SS. It's an LT. With the naturally aspirated 2.2 engine. (LAP) Not a performance car at all. I regularly get 33-36 mpg in it. It's been a good car. Wish the Sonic had as well.

 

[Dustin]

Dustin and Ineff, let us know if the trans replacement fix your problem. I'm on my 3rd trans (third shifter, third clutch, second flywheel, etc) and mine is worse than ever. I get a grind in 3rd gear (not as frequent as 2nd) and seems like the downshift from 3rd to 2nd misses about 1/3rd of the time.

My last 4 cars were a 97 z28, 99 trans am, 06 GTO, and 09 Cobalt (still have it) and all are manuals and none of them grind. GTO was prone to missing 3rd sometimes but that was something we always griped about. The point is that I know how to drive GM manuals.

Well, at this point I dropped the car off on Thursday to have the trans replaced. They called Friday saying it was done. When they went to get the car the only resistance on the clutch pedal was the return spring. The tech that did the trans won't be back until Monday to figure out what went wrong.

I've already called GM Customer Care for a second time. It took a week after I called them for a trans to show up, and now coming up on 5 weeks since I took it in for the grinding issue. I've had two rentals that suck and at this point, I just want my car back that I'm paying for and can't use.

Monday will be 5 days that they've had my car for something that they only get paid maybe 6 book hours for. I'm pretty sure my dealer is incompetent.

Edit: I went up there after hours to grab some stuff so I can go fishing tomorrow. I wanted to see how bad it was. The clutch pedal has 0 resistance, like the return spring is the only thing keeping it off the floor. The brake pedal also goes all the way down to a hard stop with next to no effort. Since the clutch and brake master is one unit I'm 95% sure this is more than just not bleeding the clutch slave, more like they forgot to connect the hydraulic line. I'll probably go back tomorrow after fishing to see if it's leaking brake fluid and get pictures. I'm totally pissed at this scenario and my dealer as well as GM Customer Care have been blowing it off like I have unrealistic expectations to have a car fixed in a timely manner.

Edit 2: Went fishing, caught a mess of bream and a few small bass. Seems the lunkers are in hiding with the temps so high. I stopped by and inspected the car further, the line going to the slave is leaking at the bleeder valve and where it connects to the hard line under the battery. There's also 3 threaded holes in the trans that don't have bolts holding the trans to the engine. I'm just going to ask them to put it back on the rack for inspection once they say it's fixed. This is by far the worst experience I've had with a "repair". I'd have been better off doing it myself.

 

[Dustin]

All trans bolts are back in after having them get it on the rack to bleed the hydraulic system again. They tried to give it back to me again with the clutch not fully disengaging on the floor.

The new trans is incredibly notchy, and has blocked me from shifting into second a few times at 3k RPMs, and third has already had a nice crunch. Already checked shift cables, they're in alignment.

I have a feeling Chevy is about to eat this car. I live in FL where today the car was showing 107*F ambient temps. The only times I've really had an issue with the trans are when it's >90* outside.

 

[ChrisJ]

Is it just me, or does it seem like anytime someone gets a new trans it's 10X worse than the original?

 

[Dustin]

Is it just me, or does it seem like anytime someone gets a new trans it's 10X worse than the original?

While you'd hope it would fix it, I'm starting to think the techs just half ass warranty repairs since they're not making as much as they would with customer pay jobs. It took two attempts of them delivering the car to have them bleed the hydraulic system that they had to take apart.

 

[Stew]

Is it just me, or does it seem like anytime someone gets a new trans it's 10X worse than the original?

That does seem to be the case on this forum more than once.

And how did they get it out of the shop with the clutch pedal either not having resistance and then sticking near the floor? Did they push it out instead of drive it?

I've never worked as a dealer mechanic so I haven't 'walked a mile' in those tech's shoes, but come on.

 

[Dustin]

That does seem to be the case on this forum more than once.

And how did they get it out of the shop with the clutch pedal either not having resistance and then sticking near the floor? Did they push it out instead of drive it?

I've never worked as a dealer mechanic so I haven't 'walked a mile' in those tech's shoes, but come on.

No idea, the tech didn't have an answer for why it was able to be driven out of the shop and 30 minutes later the clutch never disengaged.

I *have* worked at dealers. Warranty work was always put on the back burner for customer pay since the techs make more per hour on customer pay. This causes jobs to get rushed and in turn mistakes made.