hill hold

[klystron]

I almost pulled the trigger on a Sonic two days ago but decided to hold off until I can find out if the hill hold feature can be disabled. Do any owners know anything about this? I called Chevy and they tried to bribe me with $500 in loyalty cash but they didn't seem to think the feature could be enabled or disabled like traction control.

Not trying to start an argument here, btw. I'm very interested in a 1.4 and don't want any help on the hills. It may be something that can be disabled in the computer (I'm a HPTuners guy with my turbo GTO) but I'm sure it'll be a long time before we see support for it from HPT.

Also interested in any experiences anyone has had with it. I've read things on Suby and VW forums about people feel like they have to fight against the brakes.

ADMINS: please move this to the transmission forum. somehow i missed that. sorry!

 

[BNRacing]

I would think it could be turned off. As soon as we get a hold of one we could probably check it out.

 

[klystron]

Sounds good. I'm interested in a trifecta tune if/when I get the car. Though if HPT ever releases support I would just do that myself as I've already got 6 credits left. (I'm cheap, and I never manged to blow up the GTO.) I do some work for Devil's Own on the side and it would be cool to put one of our new controllers in the car.

 

[BNRacing]

We don't lock the PCM or anything but it IS a different OS that HPT can't read. You'd have to download a stock Sonic flash from the repo and do a write entire. After that HPT would be able to read/write to the PCM again. (I also use HP Tuners)

 

[klystron]

We don't lock the PCM or anything but it IS a different OS that HPT can't read. You'd have to download a stock Sonic flash from the repo and do a write entire. After that HPT would be able to read/write to the PCM again. (I also use HP Tuners)

Well I meant if HPT supports the car I would not get the trifecta tune. It just depends on what support looks like. Not saying the trifecta is bad but just that hpt is cheaper for me since I already have it.

 

[laborsmith]

HPT has been "working" on developing a tune for the V6 Camaro for so long I can not remember when that rumor started. To this day, as far as I know,there is not a HPT tune for the V6 Camaro. I admit I lost interest a few months ago when my interests changed vehicles and something may have been released in the last month or two, but I doubt it. Trifecta has for a very long time been marketing a tune for the V6 Camaro. There are others also with their own product, but Trifecta seems to be the only one seeking a nation wide market in the V6 Camaro line.

My point: the V6 Camaro sells in the several thousand every month and the Sonic in all its guises is projected at 37,000 a year. Of course, the Trifecta tune was developed for the Cruze, which sells more in total every month than does the Camaro. Nevertheless, I have a hard time believing HPT will see the Sonic or the Cruze 1.4T market as something to capture their interest.

Laborsmith

 

[laborsmith]

After my post above, I have thought about the original post, and I am wondering what is interfering about hill hold? I am asking, because this is one of the reasons I am returning to manual transmissions. Although I have never rolled back into someone behind me I have come close, at least in my mind, so the one element that addressed my concern is hill hold. (I have owned numerous mt vehicles, from my first new vehicle - a 1974 Cherokee, to the Cobalt SS/SC I traded in for my Camaro, and I still own a 4 speed Corvair, although it get driven only a thousand or so miles a year, which is to say I am quite familiar with driving them.) So any issues you care to fill out with info I would be happy to consider.

Laborsmith

 

[piro216]

Note that it is looking like he is talking about other hill holds, not the one on the Sonic. I have searched the internet and I have yet to see a single complaint about how the hill hold on the Sonic works. I have seen some of the complaints about the other brands though. However, with the Sonic, it looks like the computer knows when you hit that magic point of neutrality, were your clutch and gas are at that perfect spot and you don't go backwards or forwards, and releases the brake. Or maybe it releases once you hit the gas, I haven't been able to tell yet.

 

[klystron]

After my post above, I have thought about the original post, and I am wondering what is interfering about hill hold? I am asking, because this is one of the reasons I am returning to manual transmissions. Although I have never rolled back into someone behind me I have come close, at least in my mind, so the one element that addressed my concern is hill hold. (I have owned numerous mt vehicles, from my first new vehicle - a 1974 Cherokee, to the Cobalt SS/SC I traded in for my Camaro, and I still own a 4 speed Corvair, although it get driven only a thousand or so miles a year, which is to say I am quite familiar with driving them.) So any issues you care to fill out with info I would be happy to consider.

Laborsmith

Piro216 is right. I can't find any real reviews of the sonic hill hold. I've seen people who say they love it and hate it on other brands. I'm basically acting out of principle. I want full control of the vehicle. Of course, I normally wouldn't roll backwards with my foot on the clutch because I have replaced clutches and know what happens to slave cylinders that spin too much. I would simply have it in neutral. However, I want to be able to, on a hill, sit there in neutral, put it in gear, and then immediately go I should be able to do that. I don't want to push through the brake to get moving. I understand the theory is that once the clutch plate moves the brake should be released and you won't really feel it, but I don't really like the thought of it. I've always owned manuals and I want to continue to own manuals. I just like them. I'd love to hear from anyone with a manual sonic who can describe what it's like. Piro says it's "magic" but I'd like to see how it behaves if you try to make it hold a hill and then what it takes to get out of it.

Thanks for pointing out trifecta gets things on the market. If HPT won't support it I'll probably have to go with a trifecta. Maybe I'll sell the HPT if they stop supporting new vehicles. The reason they keep it in beta is because a law or regulation was apparently passed that prevents them from selling it because it allows people to mess around with the emissions controls. Not sure if this is true or not.

 

[jlslatton]

I've had the hill hold engage for me a few times now and have found it to be helpful and a non-issue. I've been driving a stick for 15 years and know how to start on a hill without issue. However, the hill hold is a pretty sweet idea and the sonic has a good implementation of it. There is a youtube video out there of an engineer/sales guy talking about the sonic version and how it differs from previous implementations of the technology.

I like it. Works well, IMO.

 

[klystron]

jlslatton, is there some indicator on the dash that the feature is engaged?

 

[jlslatton]

Not that I've seen. If you look at the gauge cluster there doesn't seem to be a place for it anyway.

You'll certainly know it when it's working

 

[Sonic]

This should probably be in the braking forum, since the hill hold utilizes the brakes.

 

[SonicTim]

personally i think people should just know how to drive a stick and not have a computer help them. i just picked up a sonic last friday and love it. the hill hold is a cool idea, but if they keep adding electronic assists the cars will be shifting themselves soon and you might as well buy an automatic

 

[Sonic]

Skynet is coming online!

 

[sdgdf]

I've never had problems with mine, you get used to it. Its rougher than how I usually do it but its not bad. My only concern is how well it'll work at 60k or 100k miles.

And it does help. The car tends to roll a lot. For some reason on my Fiero the brakes catch more, or there's more resistance in the transaxle or something, so it doesn't roll back much on hills. The MR2 Turbo I had, it was gutless below 2000RPM and it had very bad rollback. Around here there's a couple hills that are straight vertical, that I couldn't handle in the MR2. I tested the Sonic's hill-holder on them and it worked perfect . I've seen people driving automatics having trouble on those hills.

 

[AndrewGS]

I've only driven on inclines severe enough to make it work a few times, but each time it worked perfectly and without interference to my launch. I like it because you're not burning the clutch while you come off the brakes.

 

[Kyle1993]

It seems to only work 1 out of 10 times for me, I dont know if its because its not a steep enough incline or im doing something wrong but it doesnt bother me. I like the challenge of not rolling backwards and whats next? a computer that disengages the cluth to prevent killing the car if you dont give it enough gas? I believe formula 1 cars already have that so I wouldnt be surprised if new cars start getting it in a few years.

 

[dvn]

I've only started on a slight incline a few times but it has never worked for me. The car definitely wants to roll backwards. You must have to be on a pretty steep hill!

 

[BrianJ88]

Ive never been on a hill steep enough for it to work... I guess that what happens when you live in a relatively flat area..